BBC: Mystery Flights, CIA "Renditions" & Torture


You won't see any thing like this broadcast in the US. Full length at an hour long, its 48MB in all. The vid was posted on June 4th.

Nearly every second is compelling. Eyewitness accounts with airport personnel in Poland, tracking of CIA Aircraft N379P, accounts of attempts to frame Padilla, face time with Dick Marty, interview with former head of the CIA in Europe Tyler Drumheller, details of the Masri rendition and more, much more, compiled into typical BBC style.

It's simply the most strikingly undeniable report I've ever seen to date. You probably already know the story of CIA renditions in Europe is blowing open. Denials all over the place, lawsuits, reports that the program has simply moved to Ethiopia, Morocco, Kyrgyzstan, elsewhere, and this:

The picture that proves 'torture flights' are STILL landing in the UK - June 9

I have my determinations. Watch and judge for yourself.


ww June 9, 2007 - 9:26pm
( categories: USA: Intel and Policy )

was touring Euro capitals denying categorically that there were torture - sorry, "rendition" - sites in Eastern Europe after the Dana Priest story broke in the WaPo...you notice, of course, there has been no comment from the pianist since the Council of Europe report was released. Well, perhaps Ian Welsh can start another "thank God for Condi" thread and find some extenuating data to airbrush away her behaviour then.



“les Etats-unis, c’est le seul pays à être passé de la préhistoire à la décadence sans jamais connaitre la civilisation…”...Georges Clemenceau

barrisj redux June 9, 2007 - 10:45pm

I'm still hoping it was a post aberration brought on by cold medicine. :D

Tina June 9, 2007 - 11:00pm

Complicit Condi is little more than a catalyst inhibitor doing exactly what she's supposed to be doing for the 'good guys'; attempting to control the speed of unfolding events. I've read or listened to a few things in the last couple of days ... I'm trying to decide whether to believe my good sense ... or my lyin' eyes ... but I can't deny that I think it's all a scam. A confidence game in the most grand and despicable way you could imagine. It all fits. The Iraq war is a success in certain circles. Oil prices skyrocket, billons gone missing (but somebody has it), ME in turmoil ensuring the future of the war profiteers and ruling class grandkids. Dubai is hot this time of year.

Economic hit men working thru the WTO, IMF, World Bank ... using these same war profiteers ... and the black ops. The CIA? Forget them. The NSA is literally twice a huge, and way deeper undercover. It's all a scam. Democracy? Dead. Except for its usefulness to herd the masses. It's a ruse. George Washington warned us about standing armies. It has come to pass. The prophetic warning Eisnhower tried make clear to us ... his nightmare lives.

The problem is, the Empire is unsustainable. Make no mistake. This helps us, the common folk, not a whit. In fact, we've been paying for it, and will continue to pay for it. But change is coming. Big.

Best plan carefully for the next two decades. There are no 'sides'. Perhaps 'us' and 'them'. But that's not even a proper contest.

Want a taste of what I mean? Put the video I just posted together with the links below and tell me what you come up with. And sorry, platitudes about rule of law, homilies about self government, and philisophical recitations on the betterment of man won't cut it. The veil is being pulled off. Soon, it will be every man/woman for themselves (again), forced to operate the way it's really always been operating; if you want it, you have to take it.

No, its not just these couple interviews and reports that I point to now that leave me with these dire convictions. They are a piece of the whole. Still, listen to these. Be apprised, it will take more than five minutes:

John Perkins on "The Secret History of the American Empire: Economic Hit Men, Jackals, and the Truth about Global Corruption"

The Fallacy of Full Spectrum Dominance

Now, I'm just a guy. A family man with two young boys. There is no taking advantage of the situation for me. There is only the wish to protect them as best I can. Problem is, there is no future. People around me are droppin' like flies, losing their homes, their jobs, their health, their chance at an education. No relief in slight. The democrats? Heh. Same cloth, different pattern. There will be no calvary. There can't be. The crimes are so huge merely exposing them will cause political implosion. The inevitable slide toward oblivion will happen somewhat slowly for some, but a lot quicker, I think, than anybody is ready for. I'm talking about the disintegration of life as we know it. The wheels are coming off. All of them.

I'm also trying to find a reason for hope that the worst won't happen. Thing is, in many ways it already has. But not all the results are in. What it all devolves into I can only guess, and cringe.

Like I said, Iraq is a success. We're staying. The black prisons and torture are embarrassing world rulers, but that feeling will pass. Compared to what has already been going on for a long time it matters little. So, now we know. Like Bandar says,"So what?" In the end a few guys going to jail accomplishes nothing, if it even happens. Revolt? I don't see it, but that's like killing yourself because someone is trying to murder you. Not really a solution. It's over.

I apologize if I ruined your a day. And to those who would laugh it off as a tinfoil inspired rant I say FU and GL. Go to WalMart and buy your kid some Chinese manufactured birthday present and then tell him to join the Marines because serving your country is a noble thing to do.

Ya, I hope I get over it myself. I'm left to wonder how much denial I have me. And I'm really hoping someone smarter than me writes or says something intelligent that gives me a reason to hope that my boys have something to look forward to other than despair and a grim life here in the US. A bonus would be that the American 'experiment' isn't over. Mutual interest and benefit is the best I can come with. It ain't much to hang a hat on. Have a nice day.

ww June 10, 2007 - 9:50am

and this one is.

Thanks.

I did inhale.

Don June 10, 2007 - 10:40am

you would go all lasthorseman on us. ;-)

Tina June 10, 2007 - 10:41am

stuff like this comes to light eventually, but not until a respectable amount of time has passed, so we can say, but we aren't doing that any longer when in fact we are.

Which of the viable presidential candidates now running from either party would do anything to stop this? (aside from Dennis Kucinich or Ron Paul and the fix is in against those guys). Hillary, Edwards, Obama, McCain, Romney, Giuliani or Fred Thompson?

So we will get more of the same until the laws of nature have their way with us and they will.

For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction.

Lord have mercy.

Pray that one of these days, it isn't someone from your family that gets "rendered".

I did inhale.

Don June 10, 2007 - 11:54am

... I've reached my tipping point. My 'last throes', as it were.

ww June 10, 2007 - 1:49pm

...warning about standing armies while he was creating one, you seem to hate an empire while decrying it's end.

Empires are built only by people who think having more power and money than anybody else is a worthy goal. There really, in absolute numbers, aren't all that many of them, but they scramble their way to the top and tend to have their way. When an empire is in ascendance, the empire's middle class tends to do well - it's really the same story as here, but emphasis on politics more than economics. So the middle class buys into empire. Once empire has reached it's peak, all the benefits accrue to the elites, but the narrative still sells and the middle class still backs it.

Empires end. They can end with a bang or a whimper. You can go down fighting vainly to the end for a cause manufactured out of nostalgia and patriotism, or you can put on your best shit-eating grin and get used to the fact that your days or living high off someone else's hog are over (if, in fact, you ever got to do so).

So there are a couple things you can do. Don't vote for anyone who wants to go macho in the face of the inevitable, and start practicing your shit-eating grin.

Gordon June 10, 2007 - 11:43am

"you seem to hate an empire while decrying it's end"

I can't deny this entirely, in the literal, superficial way it appears. Though I have to say living high off the hog was never my style, nor something I aspire to. I would just as soon leave grubbing for sustenance every waking hour off the list of things to grin and bear, though.

And ya, the idea (and practice) of Empire always struck me as unjust and, therefore, not desirable. What I meant by the Empire not being sustainable was not that I wanted it to continue, but that it couldn't be corrected with our nation/democracy left intact. Britain did it. We won't.

If I decry anything its this above all else; it is all so unnecessary. (the subtext about immoral acts etc in my/our name assumed) That's tragedy, not comeuppance.

And I'm pissed about having to unnecessarily make a choice you accurately explain. Hardly a choice at all. And you left one out. Leave, which is a viciously onerous choice to consider. Yet it may be the only one that saves the lives of my sons. See, if it were just me I was deciding for it would be easier by orders of magnitude.

Just to be clear, I'm not trying to defend my ranting on about the state of affairs exactly. It is what it is and I guess I feel better for having done it, thanks to those who bothered to respond. Imagine my angst had no one noticed. It is at once a warning and a test to see if my fight or flight response is really justified.

ww June 10, 2007 - 1:46pm

By Mark Trevelyan, Security Correspondent
REUTERS

5:39 a.m. June 11, 2007

LONDON – Renewed charges that Poland and Romania hosted CIA secret prisons are not supported by hard proof and the European Union has little appetite to probe deeper, diplomats and parliamentarians say.

Nineteen months after the allegations first surfaced, European investigator Dick Marty said last week it was now 'proven' that both countries housed senior terrorist suspects at secret sites where the U.S. Central Intelligence Agency subjected them to aggressive interrogation amounting to torture.

For Marty, the 'proof' lay in interviews with more than 30 U.S. and European intelligence sources, some of whom he quoted verbatim in his 72-page report for the Council of Europe, a human rights watchdog.

But the price of getting them to talk – a promise of anonymity – was high: it allowed the Polish and Romanian governments to repeat their denials and attack his credibility.

'It's not enough for me. We have to see proofs ... Without the names, it's a problem for us,' said Wolfgang Kreissl-Doerfler, a member of a European Parliament committee which has also investigated secret prisons.

'He doesn't really present any proof in the report itself, he merely claims he has it. I can't say how reliable or unreliable his sources may have been,' said a senior European diplomat who specialises in security issues.

'SERIOUS CONSEQUENCES'

The stakes for both countries are potentially high. EU Justice and Security Commissioner Franco Frattini said in November 2005 that if reports of secret CIA prisons in Europe were true, states would face serious consequences including the possible suspension of their EU voting rights.

But despite comments from a Commission spokesman last week that Poland and Romania should hold urgent, independent investigations, there is no enthusiasm among member states for 'digging up dirt' on the pair, the European diplomat said.

'You don't go around asking unpleasant questions to partners like that,' he said.

Such probing could rebound awkwardly against countries such as Italy and Germany, which were themselves criticised by Marty for hiding behind state secrecy to obstruct investigations of CIA operations involving their own nationals or territory.

Suspension of a member's voting rights is in any case hardly conceivable because it could paralyse the workings of the EU.

'Any state that gets its voting rights blocked would probably find a dozen ways of so undermining the Council that it's not fun for anybody else,' the diplomat said. Attempts to isolate Austria after a far-rightist party joined the goverment in 2000 'failed miserably after six months', the diplomat noted.

Kreissl-Doerfler, a Social Democrat politician from Germany, said Marty's report could prompt the European Parliament to reopen its own investigation.

But he criticised Marty for keeping his findings to himself and failing to share his alleged proof with the parliament committee before it finalised its own report in February.

'The problem is, Marty never worked very well together with the European Parliament,' Kreissl-Doerfler told Reuters. 'If he had this proof, why didn't he give it to us? We have more force than the Council (of Europe).'

What Marty and many commentators agree on is that the allegations are not going away. Marty wrote that some of his sources might be willing to testify publicly in future if circumstances changed.

German newspaper Sueddeutsche Zeitung said the best chance of getting at the truth may lie in efforts by the Democrat-led U.S. Congress to probe aspects of the way the war on terrorism has been waged. President George W. Bush has acknowledged secret CIA prisons existed, but has not disclosed where.

'If those responsible in the CIA are really held accountable, Poland and Romania may be still be threatened with compromising revelations,' the paper said in a commentary.

'The same applies to Germany or Italy. Then Marty's suppositions could yet be followed by genuine proofs.'

Tina June 11, 2007 - 1:06pm

The rest of the documentary's episodes are also available at utube if you break out of barris' link. Longish and ultra depressing. Nevertheless, everybody except ww should have a look. "Unpleasant questions", indeed.

Chickadee June 11, 2007 - 4:30pm

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