The Road To Serfdoom: How Libertarianism is going to lead America to a New Great Depression


Idiots on parade:

Lies about WPA and depression thing from the world's dumbest magazine. When are we going to just wipe Wired? No publication, other than the Wall Street Journal editorial page has done more damage to the economy by hiring the most doctrinaire libertarians and letting them loose to find the most destructive course of action possible. Ryan Singel calls for data, but gets facts wrong. Hence, Ryan Singel is a hypocritical moron.

Spouting Thomas wants a gas tax. There is a reason why input taxes on rent don't work. Every time elites call for a gas tax, it is because they are admitting what a useless bunch of blood suckers they are. Then, like a flash the idiotic idea appears to them! "Make the Poor Pay!" And they go out chanting this as the solution to all the world's problems. "Make the poor pay!" The reality is that gasoline is cheap right now, and that is virtually the only thing holding many families up. Friedman's "ideas" for dealing with the blow hammer people who are just holding on in the cash economy, who are evading social security taxes, because they otherwise would have no money at all. Great job Thomas, destroy the people just holding on, and bankrupt social security all at once! Friedman is so bad at economics that of course he is published all over the place: only people who are blithering idiots can, year after year, tell the useless classes how important they are. The useless classes are willing to spend untold amounts of other people's money to hear this.

Olmert and all of his apologists. Destroying police and government buildings is in no way going to stop the use of low scale criminal attacks by Palestinians. It would be like Japan using nuclear weapons on the US for the rapes that occur of Japanese nationals by US service personnel.

Forbes Magazine the official publication of the biggest morons in the world says that State Capitalism is wrong. They were enormously quiet about this threat when big defense budgets delivered big profits and right wing majorities, and when they were making money from China, which is state capitalism at it's best. Tim W. Ferguson isn't just an idiot, or even a dishonest idiot, he's a blitheringly obvious idiot. If it were up to him, the world banking system would have completely collapsed by now, as systematic banks would have imploded.

The reality is that idiocy is still in vogue.


Stirling Newberry December 29, 2008 - 6:19am
( categories: Miscellany )

I agree with you on the WPA and depression misrepresentation. However, the main point of the article that the telecoms etc. are withholding information on the functioning of the internet and are not being forced by the FCC to provide that info and thus broadband in the U.S. is languishing is a valid and substantial and anything but libertarian viewpoint.

hvd December 29, 2008 - 7:39am

Japan's regulatory structure is even more opaque, and guess what, their broadband is 10 times faster than ours.

The problem isn't in the obscure details, it is in plain sight: fibre and wireless umbrellas.

Stirling Newberry December 29, 2008 - 7:43am

But in this case the "libertarian" is blaming the regulators for not regulating enough - scarcely a libertarian position.

hvd December 29, 2008 - 11:05am

honest courts are critical to the libertarian philosophy and Bush gave them stand down orders.

mrmx December 31, 2008 - 3:19am

for the place authoritarianism brought us.

Inauthentic, to say the least.

I did inhale.

Don December 29, 2008 - 8:59am

And I still know Marxists who make apologies for Stalin.

Deregulation mania and the cult of innovation, hatred of government in the economy are libertarian.

Own up.

Stirling Newberry December 29, 2008 - 3:04pm

True libertarians stress individual rights and repsonsibliites and do not grant those rights to corporations, nor do they allow people to hide behind corporate veils erected to absolve personal accountability.

I'm not saying libertarians have all the answers.

What I am saying is that you are pointing fingers at the wrong people.

It wasn't the Ron Pauls, Mike Gravels, Dennis Kuncinichs or Ralph Naders of the world that got us into this mess.

The Dahli Lama is a libertarian leftist. Stalin was an authoritarian leftist.

Hitler was a right of center authoritatian (fascist), similar to bush. Milton Friedman was far right and almost nuetral on the north south axis.

ps. I will own up to one thing: I hate government regulation on a personal basis, mainly because it's so bad, and applied to protect interests of the rich and corporations rather than those of the common man.

I did inhale.

Don December 29, 2008 - 3:36pm

I believe that regulatory agencies can never be effective since they're not the ones in the trenches looking for innovation.

Moreover, most people are happy, I think, that the church is out of the loop: we want the freedom to proclaim that the world is round.

An interesting video about the regulation of "credit cards" is here: "the secret history of credit cards."

The states of South Dakota and Delaware apparently didn't have regulations and that's why the big banks went there.

At the end of the day, I hope we're getting back to the "right question" of "how can we end poverty" versus getting stuck in the "useless question" of "what interest rate should Americans pay?"

mrmx December 29, 2008 - 4:20pm
Don December 29, 2008 - 9:22am

I was talking to my cousins wife and she wanted to stay at home with her baby and, moreover, she wanted to receive a check from the government for her efforts. I told her: "there are over 450 million people in India living below the poverty line so more children aren't necessarily needed." On top of that, people have come to expect 24x7 service and that expectation is taking away our freedom to jump out of the economic system.

I subsequently sent my uncle's brother a link to A Primer On The Nature Of Growth which suggests that in 2400 years, the mass of humanity will equal the mass of the earth if current population trends continue. That's notable since the human species has only been around for 50,000 years according to scientists.

Hence, I really don't think that WPA policies can pull our asses out of the fire since there aren't enough underlying resources to support growth-- as your article implies.

Moreover, I believe that WPA funding made things worse since the interstate highway system ultimately helped bring on global warming since there was no reason to live locally any more. This policy, I believe, also led to an increased desire to extract resources.

mrmx December 29, 2008 - 4:37pm

Needed to be said.

someofparts December 29, 2008 - 9:45am

Even a high school student can grasp that an extensive fiber optic infrastructure is a crucial prerequisite for enabling national broadband capability. Laying fiber cables to all homes and offices in high and medium-density population centers is a blindingly obvious national technology policy priority.

It is proof of the crippling effects of Libertarian damage to our society that any proposals for obviously useful national IT infrastructure investment are viewed with fear and trembling by the usual idiots of the commercial press.

The neo-libertarian attack on government launched in the Reagan years is like some terrible social autoimmune disease that has ravaged our body politic. We now have an entire generation of "thought leaders" who despise government planning and resist investment in public goods, no matter how essential this investment is for the economic recovery of our nation.

HH December 29, 2008 - 10:49am

I bought a home 5 miles and across the county line from my previous address. Our taxes are higher, my new neighbors make more than my old ones, and the schools are better.

My old house was serviced by TDS Telecom. We had DSL. My new house is serviced by SBC Global. We don't even have voice mail on our phone line.

I was after SBC for months to provide more services to our growing area, told them they would get all of my telecom biz if they did so. There's a fiber box about a mile away sitting dead. They simply won't spend the bucks to expand services.

They are silly. They won't expand because people like me have kicked them to the curb and found alternatives and dropped even their landlines. Its because they refused to provide them that I was determined to find a way to deny them a nickel of my biz. I told 'em, they just wouldn't listen. Telecoms were dereg'd in exchange for promises to lay fibre throughout the nation, I thought.

ww December 29, 2008 - 11:25am

Fiber a mile away. "Not cost effective to hook it up."

My options were dialup or a satellite BB connection. I went with dial-up for a couple of weeks, then ponyed up for the satellite. The contract was for $1500. But it did work.

tjfxh December 29, 2008 - 12:18pm

stresses individual rights and responsibilities, not corporate rights.

I've become leery of anything starting with "neo".

If I had to assess meaning for "neo" after looking at the evidence, my definition would be "not really" in a negative sort of way.

I did inhale.

Don December 29, 2008 - 2:53pm

The reign of ignorance in the commentariat leads to the obfuscation of the simplest facts about fiber optic infrastructure. The most costly component of the build-out, the physical stringing of the fiber to points of service, also has the lowest technology risk. With almost unlimited speed potential and excellent resistance to deterioration, the fiber cabling will be able to support many successive generations of terminating electronics, allowing carriers and consumers to ramp up bandwidth as local preferences and economics dictate. But without fiber in place, nothing can proceed. Copper phone wiring is crap, and coaxial cable has a limited lifetime, with a zero-sum bandwidth that is shared with TV signals. Only fiber offers an ideal combination of long service life and arbitrarily high bandwidth.

What does it take to get this simple concept into the heads of the cast of clowns we call our opinion makers? The need for a national fiber data infrastructure is directly analogous to the need for a national rail and highway infrastructure. I hope the Obama administration can grasp this obvious opportunity.

HH December 29, 2008 - 12:01pm

Interestingly, the United States is thoroughly laden with totally dark fiber optic cables. One of the few benefits of the telecom bubble (yes sometimes bubbles leave a useful infrastructure, at least when they involve real objects rather than paper games).

Here in Minnesota, a city got sued by its monopoly ISP in an effort to prevent the city from building its own array of fiber. It'll be community owned and operated, seems like an excellent template for what everyone is ranting about here.
http://www.monticellofiber.com/

BTW If you think Wired is riddled with blinkered libertarians, spend a while on slashdot. I like Wired's Danger Room and other areas spotting weird and ominous developments among the techno-fascists in the security complex. At least the libertarians instinctively loathe those people. That kind of tension is important to keeping the bastards in check!
--
Hongpong.com

HongPong December 29, 2008 - 1:06pm

When voice telephony was rolled out, many decades ago, government was not the enemy in America, so a far-sighted policy of universal service was mandated. In exchange for its monopoly, the Bell System was required to provide telephone service to all households, no matter how remote. Today, America needs to mandate universal broadband service. This is desirable for the following reasons:

1. Global industrial competitiveness
2. Energy conservation
3. Digital democracy

A combination of fiber optic and high-speed wireless service (e.g., WiMax from fiber-connected hubs) can deliver universal broadband Internet access to all American homes and businesses in just a few years. The fact that this initiative is being resisted is proof of how badly crippled our Federal Government has become.

HH December 29, 2008 - 3:24pm

One approach is to split the telecom universe into wholesalers and retailers. The number of total subscribers is a major part of the valuation formula for telcos with retail exposure. A wholesale-only company is strictly a commodity provider and has no choice but to build build build. The retail-only company is also a commodity vendor but can focus on competing in the retail market. Both will be flatter and more nimble companies.

“The Playboy reader invites a female acquaintance in for a quiet discussion of Picasso, Nietzsche, jazz, sex.” - Hugh Hefner

Tonsure Wimple December 29, 2008 - 6:28pm

I'm a longtime Silicon Valley programmer type. Libertarians here are the nerdy kids who had to eat lunch at their own table and were picked last for crapball. They are generally estranged from society and thus are immature about The Social Contract.

What's your local libertarian psychological profile?

“The Playboy reader invites a female acquaintance in for a quiet discussion of Picasso, Nietzsche, jazz, sex.” - Hugh Hefner

Tonsure Wimple December 29, 2008 - 6:32pm

population expansion promises to change the way we think; hence, at that point, others will embrace the libertarian philosophy because nature itself will break the social contract and declare it impossible.

based on this calculation, if our population keeps expanding at its current rate, the mass of humanity will equal the mass of the planet within 2400 years so something has to give. Mankind, as we know it, has only been around-- according to scientists, for 50,000 years!

the "social contract," in which you believe in has been, IMO, based on the discovery of oil and the subsequent inventions which used that energy to efficiently extract resources from the earth.

Hence, those who believe in "social contracts--" in my opinion, embrace them because, psychologically, their greed becomes moral by giving that same privilege to the next generation-- even though it's not sustainable.

I'm a libertarian, I think, because my father wasn't sentimental. His sister, though, is very sentimental and believes in social contracts.

mrmx December 30, 2008 - 11:46am

Are they the same?

I'm a Malthusian on the evidence you cite, although it's not going to take until 2400 to unfold. We are burning through resources too quickly, and fouling the nest to boot.

I'm also a libertarian in principle, but I recognize that anarchy is only possible in a society in which everyone is enlightened — and we aren't there yet by a long shot.

As James Lovelock of Gaia fame says, We are essentially screwed, i.e., we have screwed ourselves, but we have a moral obligation to do our best anyway to avert the impending disaster.

tjfxh December 30, 2008 - 12:22pm

I will have to read up on Malthusian.

BTW: I think that the video claimed "2400 more years" so we're talking the year 4408; regardless, the mass of humanity can't equal the mass of earth unless we find other planets.

I got interested in that video since my uncle's brother told me that the mass of ants is 20x bigger than the mass of humans so his conclusion was that "the world isn't over populated." I suppose that we could start living on the oceans, underwater, etc...

I wouldn't argue that Malthusian and Libertarian are the same; my viewpoint is that libertarians don't expect socialism (extraction of resources elsewhere) to save their asses. I suppose that's why I think euthanasia should be legalized.

mrmx December 30, 2008 - 1:13pm

BTW: I think that the video claimed "2400 more years" so we're talking the year 4408

Oops, read that wrong. No matter. The tipping point is way before that. China computed some time ago that they had only fifty years to head off their falling off the cliff due to the population explosion. That's when they mandated the one child rule.

my viewpoint is that libertarians don't expect socialism (extraction of resources elsewhere) to save their asses.

Many libertarians are fond of asserting that the choice is between libertarianism or socialism, as if there were no middle ground between anarchy (government is the problem-everyone for themselves) and totalitarianism (command system where others make the decisions, destroying personal liberty and private property rights). You don't have to be into social contract theory to be able to see that we are all in this together, as the formerly powerful but selfish discover when a revolution overthrows them or they get thrown out of office by the voters.

tjfxh December 30, 2008 - 2:35pm

I used to assume that but I'm becoming skeptical. Pavlov rules our world.

mrmx December 31, 2008 - 3:16am

eom

tjfxh December 31, 2008 - 1:42pm

my favorite movie around this time of year is "Dr. Zhivago." the movie seems to get tastier and tastier the older I get...

I've concluded that the world isn't necessarily good or evil but merely that it pulls us in way too many different directions to keep ourselves grounded. that's one of the reasons why I call myself libertarian because it's therapeutic to believe that I can think through the chaos myself without bowing down to canned political thought.

hopefully society finds gravity and stays standing.

mrmx December 31, 2008 - 8:12pm

don't have to be and are not always mutually exclusive. Altruism and compassion don't necessarily disappear in a context of self-interest and disinclination to swallow socialist dictates. A portion of my (not necessarily local) profile includes:

If you ask me for help, chances are extremely good that I will... tell me that I've got to help you and I'll tell you to shove it;

If you tell me you need $200, I will give you a day's work and pay you in cash;

Stumble up to me on the street, looking homeless and destitute, and ask for money, I'll offer to buy you a sandwich or a slice of pizza, but I won't give you cash so you can buy another pint of muscatel.

Call me a prick, but if I'm forced to choose between feeding my family and feeding someone else's, mine will win every time.

I read Atlas Shrugged for the first time as a teenager and it took me a while to figure out why Objectivism couldn't work; John Galt and Dagny Taggart were, essentially, cartoon characters, intellectual and ideological superheroes akin to Wonder Woman and Superman, who simply do not exist in the real world.

But their concepts do.

Doug Richardson December 30, 2008 - 1:19pm

good point. I say I'm a libertarian because I think it's being honest. the people I know who push "social contracts" do so for personal benefit.

the non-profit economy is a hack.

mrmx December 30, 2008 - 1:36pm

I'm not sure you should pick on Tommy after all he has a moment in time named after him. Freidman moment, does any one know who said this 1st about his, Oh just give it six months and it will be better?
jo6pac

jo6pac December 29, 2008 - 10:39pm

I have already shown, in several parts of this work, by what means the inhabitants of the United States almost always manage to combine their own advantage with that of their fellow citizens; my present purpose is to point out the general rule that enables them to do so. In the United States hardly anybody talks of the beauty of virtue, but they maintain that virtue is useful and prove it every day. The American moralists do not profess that men ought to sacrifice themselves for their fellow creatures because it is noble to make such sacrifices, but they boldly aver that such sacrifices are as necessary to him who imposes them upon himself as to him for whose sake they are made.

They have found out that, in their country and their age, man is brought home to himself by an irresistible force; and, losing all hope of stopping that force, they turn all their thoughts to the direction of it. They therefore do not deny that every man may follow his own interest, but they endeavor to prove that it is the interest of every man to be virtuous. I shall not here enter into the reasons they allege, which would divert me from my subject; suffice it to say that they have convinced their fellow countrymen.

Montaigne said long ago: "Were I not to follow the straight road for its straightness, I should follow it for having found by experience that in the end it is commonly the happiest and most useful track." The doctrine of interest rightly understood is not then new, but among the Americans of our time it finds universal acceptance; it has become popular there; you may trace it at the bottom of all their actions, you will remark it in all they say. It is as often asserted by the poor man as by the rich. In Europe the principle of interest is much grosser than it is in America, but it is also less common and especially it is less avowed; among us, men still constantly feign great abnegation which they no longer feel.

The Americans, on the other hand, are fond of explaining almost all the actions of their lives by the principle of self-interest rightly understood; they show with complacency how an enlightened regard for themselves constantly prompts them to assist one another and inclines them willingly to sacrifice a portion of their time and property to the welfare of the state. In this respect I think they frequently fail to do themselves justice, for in the United States as well as elsewhere people are sometimes seen to give way to those disinterested and spontaneous impulses that are natural to man; but the Americans seldom admit that they yield to emotions of this kind; they are more anxious to do honor to their philosophy than to themselves.

I might here pause without attempting to pass a judgment on what I have described. The extreme difficulty of the subject would be my excuse, but I shall not avail myself of it; and I had rather that my readers, clearly perceiving my object, would refuse to follow me than that I should leave them in suspense.

The principle of self-interest rightly understood is not a lofty one, but it is clear and sure. It does not aim at mighty objects, but it attains without excessive exertion all those at which it aims. As it lies within the reach of all capacities, everyone can without difficulty learn and retain it. By its admirable conformity to human weaknesses it easily obtains great dominion; nor is that dominion precarious, since the principle checks one personal interest by another, and uses, to direct the passions, the very same instrument that excites them.

The principle of self-interest rightly understood produces no great acts of self-sacrifice, but it suggests daily small acts of self-denial. By itself it cannot suffice to make a man virtuous; but it disciplines a number of persons in habits of regularity, temperance, moderation, foresight, self- command; and if it does not lead men straight to virtue by the will, it gradually draws them in that direction by their habits. If the principle of interest rightly understood were to sway the whole moral world, extraordinary virtues would doubtless be more rare; but I think that gross depravity would then also be less common. The principle of interest rightly understood perhaps prevents men from rising far above the level of mankind, but a great number of other men, who were falling far below it, are caught and restrained by it. Observe some few individuals, they are lowered by it; survey mankind, they are raised.

I am not afraid to say that the principle of self-interest rightly understood appears to me the best suited of all philosophical theories to the wants of the men of our time, and that I regard it as their chief remaining security against themselves. Towards it, therefore, the minds of the moralists of our age should turn; even should they judge it to be incomplete, it must nevertheless be adopted as necessary.

I do not think, on the whole, that there is more selfishness among us than in America; the only difference is that there it is enlightened, here it is not. Each American knows when to sacrifice some of his private interests to save the rest; we want to save everything, and often we lose it all. Everybody I see about me seems bent on teaching his contemporaries, by precept and example, that what is useful is never wrong Will nobody undertake to make them understand how what is right may be useful?

Alexis de Tocqueville, Democracy in America, II, 2, 8

Emphasis added

Alexis de Tocqueville
Democracy in America
Creation of machine-readable version: Electronic edition deposited and marked-up by ASGRP, the American Studies Programs at the University of Virginia, June 1, 1997.

Freely available for non-commercial use provided that this header is included in its entirety with any copy distributed.
From the Henry Reeve Translation,revised and corrected, 1899.

tjfxh December 30, 2008 - 3:13pm

I agree with Thom Hartmann that Libertarians are mostly Conservatives who like to smoke dope and get laid. Hence the randy Randians.
As a librul white southerner, I run Libertarianism past some historical tests. I try to visualize how many black slaves of the antebellum South or southern blacks in general would be Libertarians. Big government bad. Big Federal government worse. Took away all those slave owners private property.
I think Libertarian philosopy is just fine where the human density is about 1 person per square mile or less. You just don't have to interact with others and can be free as a bird.
But we are a crowded little planet and we rub elbows frequently.
Government is about how we rub those elbows. It can be good, intelligent, fair, just, etc. or really crappy. Our choice, we collectively are the government.
And for all the social regressives and reactionaries out there....get over it or get out of the way.

JT January 2, 2009 - 5:28pm

My problem with libertarianism is simply that it tends to reflect the the more extreme individualism in our culture and, in advocating for "doing whatever you want as long as it doesn't infringe on other people's right to do what they want," it ensures that, unless you live in a vast wilderness (as was brought up by JT), you will almost certainly end up in conflict with someone else. Personal liberty and due process of law are critical in any society, but equally important is a sense of inherent responsibility to a larger community and polity. I think that part of the reason why our government tends to be so inept and corrupt is that in an individualistic society it tends in principle to be regarded as "them" rather than "us."

At the same time, I give tremendous credit to libertarians for being the most courageous, outspoken, and accurate critics during the eight years of the Bush administration. Justin Raimando of Antiwar.com, for example, has been ahead of just about anyone I can think of when it comes to challenging the Neocons early and making accurate predictions (for example, he predicted Scooter Libby would be indicted years before the story even hit the press). Ron Pal is in the similar mold, and it's no coincidence that these people are held in high regard by such old line leftists as Alexander Cockburn.

Aguilar January 2, 2009 - 7:34pm

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