Liberty and Personal Responsibility


I watched a show on the prison industry here in America this evening and it made this post by Glenn Greenwald ever more poignant and pointed. I like this graf:

Sometimes, adults make choices for their own lives that other adults perceive to be bad choices. When that happens, the adults who know better have the right to step in, pass laws to restrict the bad choices, and even make the bad choices criminal -- all for the good of the adults who don't know what's good for them.

But this one is my favorite:

Governors who hire adult prostitutes must resign immediately lest the public trust be forever sullied. Presidents who break the law by spying on Americans with no warrants, who torture people in violation of multiple treaties and statutes, who start hideously destructive wars based on false pretenses, who repeatedly proclaim the power to ignore laws, and who imprison people -- including Americans -- with no charges of any kind, should remain in office for as long as they want. Anyone who suggests otherwise is an irresponsible, shrill, partisan radical.

I've made lots of mistakes in my life and I am sure to make many, many more. (Some of them quite possibly idiotically spectacular.) But it's my life, and insofar as I don't hurt anyone--other than myself, if I so choose--then back off. It is my life we're talking about. The codicil to that is 'live and let live.' And please, spare me the woes of our prevailing boorish, bourgeois morality of conformity.


Sean Paul Kelley March 12, 2008 - 11:14pm
( categories: USA: Domestic Issues )

Last weekend, I was out cutting an old dead tree down for firewood and assumed it was going to fall the direction it was leaning, but tree and wind had other ideas and it went sideways, with the top landing on the cab of my truck. Ouch.

brodix March 13, 2008 - 8:22am

So, all is well, you did not hurt anybody else.
No, wait... Unless now you have to buy a new one using money from your kid's college fund. :) Damn, at some level, there are almost always consequences for others for one's stupid decisions.

creativelcro March 13, 2008 - 11:51am
Don March 13, 2008 - 11:56am

a la Swedish prostitution laws and aggressively prosecute prostitution rings, and then you break those rules,does that repeal the rules?

That you can get more people willing to impeach a sex hypocrite than a war criminal is nothing new.

That Spitzer's enemies, business and government would tail him is a given. I don't buy that it was a routine audit. Let's see what comes out on that one.


1."George Washington did not cross the Delaware for Capitalism," -Shmuley Boteach.
2.The Dems haven't punished the GOP enough, so you're going to reward the Republicans?

nymole March 13, 2008 - 12:36pm

What the Swedes did to solve their prostitution problem is totally amazing. It was a true eye-opener. This morning I read an article in my newspaper about this problem. I had a feeling what the conclusion was going to be. Sure enough, the columnist wrote: "Prostitution is eternal. Blame biology". Just like the true patriarchal saying: "Prostitution is the oldest profession". It's as old as patriarchy, I'd say. Stifle women's libido inside a monogamous marriage while giving their own libido free reign. Boy, do we ever need a woman in The White House.

adrena March 14, 2008 - 9:56am

In particular, hypocrisy from a crusader.

But as distasteful as it is, politics is hypocrisy; complaining about it is analogous to complaining about how dirty you got your shovel while digging a ditch.

A much bigger issue is *susceptibility to blackmail*.

Cautions about "honey traps" aren't a staple of security briefings because having sex is *immoral*.


"The best-informed man is not necessarily the wisest. Indeed there is a danger that precisely in the multiplicity of his knowledge he will lose sight of what is essential."

- Dietrich Bonhoeffer

Escher Sketch March 13, 2008 - 1:13pm

If it is legitimate to make bad choices (that don't harm others) criminal, then we either have a nation behind bars, or an arbitrary system. Take pot: treated as criminal. And many will say that users should go to jail because they broke the law.

Yet stronger arguments could be made against tobacco (its use does harm others - like the 50,000 killed each year by second-hand smoke). It is deemed OK (even though a bad habit), because it is not illegal. All it needs to be illegal is for the law makers to say it is, like they did with pot.

If all bad choices were illegal and people sent to prison for those choices, we'd have a lot more people in prison. Instead, those in power choose which bad choices to make criminal - and thus we have a system that is patently arbitrary and unfair. This is not liberty.

Prostitution? If voluntary and regulated by public health: why not? It would be safer than the illegal system we now have. Forced prostitution? that's definitely not victim-less. But it is those who force who should be prosecuted, not the prostitutes or their johns, unless it can be proven that the johns know the prostitute is indeed being forced.

don2005 March 13, 2008 - 2:11pm

Agonist is one of my most favorite places. But I'm really disappointed by this post and these comments.

I invite you to read "An American Bill of Responsibilities" at http://charltonrose.com/misc/billresp/ and P!'s "A Nation of One, Pt. 3: Of Rights and Responsibilities" at http://ddjango.blogspot.com/2007/04/nation-of-one-pt-3-of-rights-and.html

ddjango March 13, 2008 - 5:03pm

... you missed SPK's (snd Glenn's) point here. Read Greenwald's post and it will become clear.


"...cunning, baffling, powerful."

ww March 14, 2008 - 10:45am

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