I just posted this in the newswire, you beat me by a minute! I'll remove mine

we should outsource the kill to them

Blowing it up in orbit is more accurate. But that will create a huge amount of orbital space junk, something the Chinese were criticized for. Since we have all this starwars technology, why not put it to a real test and actually try to shoot the thing down in the atmosphere upon re-entry?

We have zero space capacity. Whatever advantage is there is the U.S. government's. 180 degree difference. I hold it unwise to rely on anything they put up, not cel phones or GPS or Sirius radio or Satellite television or internet connectivity or anything. Furthermore, programs like the dyna-glide and space marines bode extreme ill for anyone who disagrees with the U.S. government. Anyone, anywhere. Bad as things are now, for us, imagine the future. The 'privatization' of NASA and space is to me anything but that, it's big government under another name sans checks and balance. Mussolini times 1,000, and so on. No one is free to not submit completely to the company. A digression, but first things first.

This post's subject merely brought this post to mind:
KH-13: Summarily Disposed?
I'd always wanted to know more the rival military faction, bur never heard more. Perhaps it had something to do with issues surrounding this missile's development. Certainly Russia is somewhat a strong incentive to 'our' military to maintain cohesion, while albeit the U.S. government itself gives them cause to pause. Ironically. Now, China as well. (Thank you, President Clinton, for helping them down the road 10 years ago. For what? Two million dollars?)

Methinks you think aright, alright. Not wrong at all.
But I don't think any of it bodes well.

What's this? Doesn't this "special" missile violate the ABM treaty? What's going on?

links at ACW

The Shot
posted Thursday February 14, 2008 under outer-space by jeffrey

That’s what Ambassador James Jeffrey’s called the decision to use an an Aegis SM-3 to try to shoot down USA 193 in the next 3-12 days. (Transcript should be posted here ; video at the Pentagon Channel.)

Holding the aside the politics of this — which are terrible — the briefing on debris risk left me cold. I have to say that I am very, very uneasy about this decision — our missile defense tests have been heavily scripted to minimize debris creation and modeling of debris creation isn’t an exact science.

The burden of proof really should be on these guys to demonstrate that the risks to the ISS and other objects in space are minimal.

General Carwright, to his credit, provided enough technical information to model the intercept. David Wright is working on that right now — for those of you who can’t wait, the important numbers are:

1. The intercept will occur at 240 kilometers (130 nautical miles)
2. The mass of the satellite is 2,300 kg (5,000 pounds)
3. The mass of the interceptor is 20 kg. (From CBO)
4. The closing velocity will be 9.8 km/s (22,000 mph), suggesting a virtually head-on collision.

Other pertinent observations. At 240 km, the satellite should be traveling 7.8 km/s; the SM-3 has a burnout velocity of 3 km/s.

I am very worried about the debris creation — particularly the debris that the light-weight interceptor will kick into higher orbits when it hits the massive (bus-sized) satellite. Thnk, as Geoff Forden suggested, of a ping pong ball hitting a superball.

Virtually all the debris should come down quickly. Cartwright said 50 percent would come down within two orbits, with the rest coming down in weeks and months. That seems plausible, at first blush.

But those two orbits could be hairy and some of the debris will remain in orbit. Michael Griffin, NASA Administrator, said there are “good times and bad times” to conduct the intercept, based on the position of the ISS but that “bad times are not all that bad” comparing the risk to an order of magnitude lower than flying the shuttle.

Last I checked, the PRAN for the shuttle was 1 in 100. Extrapolating, there would be only a 1 in 1000 chance of wiping out the ISS.

Great.

Anyway, we should be able to get some real numbers in the next 24 hours.

Satellite could plummet to Earth

Does it carry any radioactive materials?

And if the answer is "no", is that a lie?

The entire world yelled at China for their ridiculously unnecessary test. Wouldn't we attract the same sort of ill will if we tried it? Shouldn't we be banning weapons in space instead of waving our massive national penis around?

Seems that now is the time to do it: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/13/world/europe/13arms.html

...ships equipped to fire the SM3 is the USS Port Royal. Of the recent small boats in the Persian Gulf fame. Let's see what entertaining stories can be spun around that. ;)

"A survey data set containing imputed values should not be analyzed uncritically as if all the data were real values." ~ Graham Kalton

A guy on the International Space Station said that all the stuff coming inside the airlock smells kind of metallic/welding, in a pleasant way. He concluded it was the smell of space. However wouldn't it more likely mostly be metal microparticles created by stupid shit like the boys playing with their big ray gun (or better yet bottle rockets)?

link: http://spaceflight.nasa.gov/station/crew/exp6/spacechronicles4.html
nerds: http://science.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/02/13/1418216
--
Hongpong.com

If the missle has enough delta-v to reach orbit (to go after that spy satellite)....what if it missed?
Would it simply fall back to earth? If not, might it pose a danget to the Space Station (if it happened to have sufficient energy to make it that high)?

Wouldn't it be just Bush's luck that the might get to take down Clinton's space station.....(yeah, oversimplifying, but Clinton was the Pres that starting putting the stuff up, I think....)

-5.75,-4.05
"We're all fucked. It helps to remember that." --George Carlin

Every spy movie I've ever seen shows the fancy gizmo with a big red self-destruct button. What happened? Who forgot it? Is this what happens when you low-bid an NRO satellite?

Really- can't they pack some heat-based explosives in the sucker shaped to blow up the naughty bits? They must have the best boom-boom goop on the planet.

“The Playboy reader invites a female acquaintance in for a quiet discussion of Picasso, Nietzsche, jazz, sex.” - Hugh Hefner

U.S. vows to pay for damage caused by satellite

By Stephanie Nebehay

GENEVA (Reuters) - The United States pledged on Friday to compensate countries if debris lands on their territory from a dying U.S. spy satellite that the Pentagon plans to shoot down.

Ambassador Christina Rocca said that if efforts fail to strike the satellite with a missile while it is still in space, it was expected to make an "uncontrolled re-entry into the earth's atmosphere on or about March 6".

The satellite is carrying more than 1,000 pounds (454 kg) of hydrazine fuel, and could release much of it as a toxic gas, according to Deputy U.S. National Security Adviser James Jeffrey.

"Whether the engagement succeeds or fails, the U.S. is prepared to offer assistance to governments to mitigate the consequences of any satellite debris impacts on their territory," Rocca told the Conference on Disarmament.

This was in keeping with a 1972 treaty on international liability for damage caused by space objects, which the United States has ratified, she said.

U.S. officials said on Thursday that President George W. Bush had decided to have the Navy shoot the 5,000-pound (2,270 kg) satellite with a modified tactical missile after security advisers suggested its re-entry could lead to a loss of life.

Rocca told the 65-member state forum that the timing of the strike would be chosen to "maximize the chance of hitting the fuel tank and to ensure that the resulting debris will re-enter quickly and thus not pose a danger to satellites and peaceful space operations".

Washington would seek to minimize the chances that any debris re-entering the atmosphere could hit a populated area.

also see round up from Raw Story

Russia worried by errant US satellite: news agencies
15 February 2008 | 22:18 | FOCUS News Agency

AFP
Moscow. Russia is carefully tracking a crippled US spy satellite that Washington plans to destroy in the coming days, and agrees it could pose a threat if it crashed to Earth, a defence ministry official said Friday, AFP informs.

"He's not bluffing when he talks about the danger posed by this satellite," the unnamed Russian official told Interfax and RIA Novosti news agencies, referring to comments made Thursday by General James Cartwright, vice chairman of the US Joint Chiefs of Staff.

The United States says the satellite is the size of a bus and contains a large quantity of hydrazine, an extremely toxic propellant.

The chemical could be dangerous to people on the ground if the satellite -- currently in Earth orbit but being pulled down by Earth's gravity -- does not burn up on re-entry, it says.

Washington says a US warship will fire a surface-to-air missile at the satellite at a specific point in its orbit that ensures any Earthbound debris will splash into the ocean.

It denies the shoot down aims at protecting the satellite's technological secrets or at demonstrating US anti-satellite capability.

A senior Russian parliamentarian echoed the defence ministry's concerns.

"The trajectory of the satellite's descent is unclear, but there is every likelihood it could fall on Russian territory," the deputy head of parliament's defence committee, Igor Barinov, told Interfax.

But Barinov also said he hoped Washington was not trying to flex its military muscles.

"If this is the Americans' answer to China's latest action in shooting down its faulty weather satellite, and if such a decision is aimed at demonstrating American power, then it could lead to a new escalation in the military sphere," he warned.

AFP

Russia tracks rogue U.S. satellite, contains nuclear material
15:23 | 15/ 02/ 2008

Print version

MOSCOW, February 15 (RIA Novosti) - Russia's Defense Ministry is closely monitoring a U.S. spy satellite that has gone out of control and may have nuclear material on board, a high-ranking defense source said on Friday.

"The Defense Ministry is using its space surveillance systems to track the satellite's movement in orbit," he said.

Russian military experts suggest the satellite could have an on board nuclear power source, a senior parliament member said.

Igor Barinov, first deputy chairman of the State Duma Defense Committee, also expressed concern that the U.S. had made a unilateral decision to destroy the satellite.

He said that decisions, which could jeopardize collective security, "should be made taking into account all parties concerned and all countries involved in space research."

The U.S. Defense Department said Thursday it would shoot down the decaying satellite, which it earlier considered to be low risk. The department said the chances that the "uncontrollable U.S. experimental satellite" will hit a populated area are small, but "the potential consequences would be of enough concern to consider mitigating actions."

The satellite was launched in 2006 and malfunctioned almost immediately. On board is around 1,000 pounds of propellant fuel (hydrazine), a hazardous material.

President George W Bush has authorized the destruction of the satellite using a sea-to-air missile within the next few days.

Earlier the director of the Henry L. Stimson Center, which monitors space security and research Michael Krepon, said that the reasons given for shooting down the satellite were "unpersuasive," adding previous satellites that had gone out of control had not caused any damage.

"The president has decided to take action to mitigate the risk to human lives by engaging the nonfunctioning satellite," the Defense Department explained in a news announcement. "Because our missile defense system is not designed to engage satellites, extraordinary measures have been taken to temporarily modify three sea-based tactical missiles and three ships to carry out the engagement."

Several government agencies are involved in monitoring and planning for re-entry of the satellite.

...that we pumped so much money into developing during the heyday of that great stinking cash sinkhole, SDI?

It would not have to be a remote-controlled Big Shiny Red Button. I was thinking more something would go off when the thing takes The Big Dive and overheats. Just enough to rip it apart into parts small enough to burn up on re-entry.

“The Playboy reader invites a female acquaintance in for a quiet discussion of Picasso, Nietzsche, jazz, sex.” - Hugh Hefner

USA 193 Risk Calculation

Don't Shoot Down USA 193

Satellite Shootdown Could Be Wednesday

* Tuesday February 19 2008

WASHINGTON (AP) - The Pentagon says the military's attempt to shot down a wayward U.S. spy satellite as it falls toward Earth could happen as early as Wednesday night, but no final decision on timing has been made.

Press secretary Geoff Morrell said Tuesday that senior military officers, including the head of the U.S. Strategic Command, are evaluating the situation and will advise Defense Secretary Robert Gates when is the best time to carry it out.

The plan is to fire a missile that would release a ``kenetic kill vehicle,'' - a non-explosive device - on a path that would enable it to collide with the satellite, destroying the spacecraft and its components by force of impact alone.

USA 193 imminent decay in the news (rewritten16/02; updated twice 19/02)
UPDATE 19/02/08: John Locker has drawn attention to a second NOTAM for the same area, one day later. This is probably for a possible second attempt if the first one fails.

http://sattrackcam.blogspot.com/2008/01/usa-193-imminent-decay-in-news.html

Atlantis shuttle returns to Earth

BBC
The Atlantis orbiter has touched down on Earth after a 13-day mission to cement Europe's position on the International Space Station (ISS).

The spacecraft and its crew installed the 12.8-tonne Columbus science lab, an achievement that makes Europe a full member of the $100bn platform project.

Atlantis landed at Florida's Kennedy Space Center at 1407 GMT.

Now that the shuttle is down, the US military will be allowed to shoot an ailing spy satellite out of the sky.

more

*crickets* even at ACW